Comments on: Is New Jersey’s State Constitution Unconstitutional? Campaign to Recall Senator Menendez Turns Into Battle of the Constitutions http://www.ifcnews.com/is-new-jersey%e2%80%99s-state-constitution-unconstitutional-campaign-to-recall-senator-menendez-turns-into-battle-of-the-constitutions/ Offshore International Financial Centre Tax and Investment News and Analysis Sun, 25 Jul 2010 22:54:34 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.0 By: Brian http://www.ifcnews.com/is-new-jersey%e2%80%99s-state-constitution-unconstitutional-campaign-to-recall-senator-menendez-turns-into-battle-of-the-constitutions/comment-page-1/#comment-4734 Brian Sun, 17 Jan 2010 19:46:52 +0000 http://www.ifcnews.com/is-new-jersey%e2%80%99s-state-constitution-unconstitutional-campaign-to-recall-senator-menendez-turns-into-battle-of-the-constitutions/#comment-4734 <p>That the US Constitution has no provision for recall of State's Senators and Congressmen is evidence in itself that the STATES have the right to recall under the enumerated powers provision of the US Constitution. If the power is not granted to the federal gov't by statute or enumerated as a federal power under the Constitution, then that power is reserved to the several States and to the people.</p> That the US Constitution has no provision for recall of State's Senators and Congressmen is evidence in itself that the STATES have the right to recall under the enumerated powers provision of the US Constitution. If the power is not granted to the federal gov't by statute or enumerated as a federal power under the Constitution, then that power is reserved to the several States and to the people.

]]> By: CM Sackett http://www.ifcnews.com/is-new-jersey%e2%80%99s-state-constitution-unconstitutional-campaign-to-recall-senator-menendez-turns-into-battle-of-the-constitutions/comment-page-1/#comment-4733 CM Sackett Sun, 17 Jan 2010 19:46:03 +0000 http://www.ifcnews.com/is-new-jersey%e2%80%99s-state-constitution-unconstitutional-campaign-to-recall-senator-menendez-turns-into-battle-of-the-constitutions/#comment-4733 <p>From A Report:<br /> REPORT AND RECOMMENDATIONS RELATING TO CONTEMPT NEW JERSEY LAW REVISION COMMISSION </p> <p>"The power of a court to punish for contempt is said by the courts themselves to be inherent, in as much as this authority is "derived from necessity" and ceases "only where such necessity ceases." State v. Doty, 32 N.J.L. 403, 404 (Supreme Ct. 1868). The contempt power is said to derive from the common law. See In re Yengo, 84 N.J. 111, 130 (1980), cited in In Re Daniels, 118 N.J. at 59; In Re Cheeseman, 49 N.J.L. 115, 139-141 (Sup. Ct. 1886); In Re Verdon, 89 N.J.L. 16, 17, 20 (Sup. Ct. 1916), rev'd on other grounds sub nom. Attorney-General v. Verdon, 90 N.J.L. 494 (E. & A. 1917); see also Illinois v. Allen, 397 U.S. 337, 347 (1970) </p> <p>(Justice Brennan called the court's constitutional power regarding contempts "fundamental to a scheme of 'ordered liberty' and prerequisite to social justice and peace.")." </p> <p>____________________________________________________ </p> <p>Holding The Secretary of State IN CONTEMPT not only has precedence (references numerous and available to even a cursory perusal of NJ cases…), but most certainly falls under the auspices of not only the spirit, but also the letter of Justice Brennan's statement on the subject: "fundamental to a scheme of 'ordered liberty' and prerequisite to social justice and peace." </p> <p>The flagrant usurpation of powers NOT GRANTED to the office (making her opinion ~ legally sound or NOT ~ the "law" in this matter, versus the standard and historic process of the judiciary 'holding court' in such), combined with the utter disregard for the existent/STANDING law of the state… make for a strong case for a "bread-n-water" break for the secretary ~ while the matter proceeds according to that same clear law. </p> <p>CM Sackett</p> From A Report:
REPORT AND RECOMMENDATIONS RELATING TO CONTEMPT NEW JERSEY LAW REVISION COMMISSION

"The power of a court to punish for contempt is said by the courts themselves to be inherent, in as much as this authority is "derived from necessity" and ceases "only where such necessity ceases." State v. Doty, 32 N.J.L. 403, 404 (Supreme Ct. 1868). The contempt power is said to derive from the common law. See In re Yengo, 84 N.J. 111, 130 (1980), cited in In Re Daniels, 118 N.J. at 59; In Re Cheeseman, 49 N.J.L. 115, 139-141 (Sup. Ct. 1886); In Re Verdon, 89 N.J.L. 16, 17, 20 (Sup. Ct. 1916), rev'd on other grounds sub nom. Attorney-General v. Verdon, 90 N.J.L. 494 (E. & A. 1917); see also Illinois v. Allen, 397 U.S. 337, 347 (1970)

(Justice Brennan called the court's constitutional power regarding contempts "fundamental to a scheme of 'ordered liberty' and prerequisite to social justice and peace.")."

____________________________________________________

Holding The Secretary of State IN CONTEMPT not only has precedence (references numerous and available to even a cursory perusal of NJ cases…), but most certainly falls under the auspices of not only the spirit, but also the letter of Justice Brennan's statement on the subject: "fundamental to a scheme of 'ordered liberty' and prerequisite to social justice and peace."

The flagrant usurpation of powers NOT GRANTED to the office (making her opinion ~ legally sound or NOT ~ the "law" in this matter, versus the standard and historic process of the judiciary 'holding court' in such), combined with the utter disregard for the existent/STANDING law of the state… make for a strong case for a "bread-n-water" break for the secretary ~ while the matter proceeds according to that same clear law.

CM Sackett

]]> By: enoughallready http://www.ifcnews.com/is-new-jersey%e2%80%99s-state-constitution-unconstitutional-campaign-to-recall-senator-menendez-turns-into-battle-of-the-constitutions/comment-page-1/#comment-4732 enoughallready Sun, 17 Jan 2010 18:54:37 +0000 http://www.ifcnews.com/is-new-jersey%e2%80%99s-state-constitution-unconstitutional-campaign-to-recall-senator-menendez-turns-into-battle-of-the-constitutions/#comment-4732 <p>As far as I can tell the only person that can challenge the constitutionality of the NJ amendment would be Sen Menendez and he would only be able to challenge it after the petition is successful.. Up and untill that point no one would have standing in a court of law as no one can claim they were injured by the petition.. </p> <p>Me thinks they need to add the SOS's Name to the list and recall her to !!! </p> <p>The total lack of knowledge by our elected officals is OUTSTANDING.. </p> <p>Remember the States give rights to the Fed. Goverment not the other way around !!!</p> As far as I can tell the only person that can challenge the constitutionality of the NJ amendment would be Sen Menendez and he would only be able to challenge it after the petition is successful.. Up and untill that point no one would have standing in a court of law as no one can claim they were injured by the petition..

Me thinks they need to add the SOS's Name to the list and recall her to !!!

The total lack of knowledge by our elected officals is OUTSTANDING..

Remember the States give rights to the Fed. Goverment not the other way around !!!

]]> By: Bohemond http://www.ifcnews.com/is-new-jersey%e2%80%99s-state-constitution-unconstitutional-campaign-to-recall-senator-menendez-turns-into-battle-of-the-constitutions/comment-page-1/#comment-4731 Bohemond Sun, 17 Jan 2010 18:35:19 +0000 http://www.ifcnews.com/is-new-jersey%e2%80%99s-state-constitution-unconstitutional-campaign-to-recall-senator-menendez-turns-into-battle-of-the-constitutions/#comment-4731 <p>I'm unsure about the Constitutionality of the recall provision vis-a-vis the 17th Amendment. But I agree that that is a determination for the Federal judiciary, or possibly the NJ courts- NOT the NJ executive.</p> I'm unsure about the Constitutionality of the recall provision vis-a-vis the 17th Amendment. But I agree that that is a determination for the Federal judiciary, or possibly the NJ courts- NOT the NJ executive.

]]> By: john http://www.ifcnews.com/is-new-jersey%e2%80%99s-state-constitution-unconstitutional-campaign-to-recall-senator-menendez-turns-into-battle-of-the-constitutions/comment-page-1/#comment-4730 john Sun, 17 Jan 2010 18:32:47 +0000 http://www.ifcnews.com/is-new-jersey%e2%80%99s-state-constitution-unconstitutional-campaign-to-recall-senator-menendez-turns-into-battle-of-the-constitutions/#comment-4730 <p>. </p> <p>This is really poetic and powerful stuff from the pages of Saul Alinsky … Tea Partiers using the socialists own rules to against them to recall a liberal slime ball. </p> <p>Sounds great … if they have to live up to their own standards they will shrivel and wilt because they are brain damaged and morally defective. </p> <p>.</p> .

This is really poetic and powerful stuff from the pages of Saul Alinsky … Tea Partiers using the socialists own rules to against them to recall a liberal slime ball.

Sounds great … if they have to live up to their own standards they will shrivel and wilt because they are brain damaged and morally defective.

.

]]> By: tiredofit2010 http://www.ifcnews.com/is-new-jersey%e2%80%99s-state-constitution-unconstitutional-campaign-to-recall-senator-menendez-turns-into-battle-of-the-constitutions/comment-page-1/#comment-4729 tiredofit2010 Sun, 17 Jan 2010 17:38:29 +0000 http://www.ifcnews.com/is-new-jersey%e2%80%99s-state-constitution-unconstitutional-campaign-to-recall-senator-menendez-turns-into-battle-of-the-constitutions/#comment-4729 <p>the cancer of liberalism and progressivism has festered far too long…time to cut it out of our collective misery….</p> the cancer of liberalism and progressivism has festered far too long…time to cut it out of our collective misery….

]]> By: fscarn http://www.ifcnews.com/is-new-jersey%e2%80%99s-state-constitution-unconstitutional-campaign-to-recall-senator-menendez-turns-into-battle-of-the-constitutions/comment-page-1/#comment-4728 fscarn Sun, 17 Jan 2010 16:47:45 +0000 http://www.ifcnews.com/is-new-jersey%e2%80%99s-state-constitution-unconstitutional-campaign-to-recall-senator-menendez-turns-into-battle-of-the-constitutions/#comment-4728 <p>NJ's constitutional provision should prevail. The US Con. supremacy clause states that the federal constitution and federal laws made in pursuance thereof will prevail over any state law or state constitutional provision, but only to the extent that the latter are contrary to anything in the US Con. or federal law in pursuant thereof. Because the US Con. does NOT have any express provision denying the states or the people from recalling their reps, and because the 10th Am. affirms that all powers not delegated remain with the people or the states, NJ should win. And should win even if there is a federal law saying that recalling federal reps or senators can not be done because that federal law would itself be unconstitutional precisely because the Constitutional document itself does NOT give Congress the necessary power to enact such a law.<br /> Expect the fur to fly on this one. Trying to limit the power of the government is like talking a bone away from a hungry dog, or more appropriately a hungry grizzly or polar bear.</p> NJ's constitutional provision should prevail. The US Con. supremacy clause states that the federal constitution and federal laws made in pursuance thereof will prevail over any state law or state constitutional provision, but only to the extent that the latter are contrary to anything in the US Con. or federal law in pursuant thereof. Because the US Con. does NOT have any express provision denying the states or the people from recalling their reps, and because the 10th Am. affirms that all powers not delegated remain with the people or the states, NJ should win. And should win even if there is a federal law saying that recalling federal reps or senators can not be done because that federal law would itself be unconstitutional precisely because the Constitutional document itself does NOT give Congress the necessary power to enact such a law.
Expect the fur to fly on this one. Trying to limit the power of the government is like talking a bone away from a hungry dog, or more appropriately a hungry grizzly or polar bear.

]]> By: yossarian22 http://www.ifcnews.com/is-new-jersey%e2%80%99s-state-constitution-unconstitutional-campaign-to-recall-senator-menendez-turns-into-battle-of-the-constitutions/comment-page-1/#comment-4727 yossarian22 Sun, 17 Jan 2010 16:44:15 +0000 http://www.ifcnews.com/is-new-jersey%e2%80%99s-state-constitution-unconstitutional-campaign-to-recall-senator-menendez-turns-into-battle-of-the-constitutions/#comment-4727 <p>I believe that we have only scratched the surface.</p> I believe that we have only scratched the surface.

]]> By: Cardinal_Fang http://www.ifcnews.com/is-new-jersey%e2%80%99s-state-constitution-unconstitutional-campaign-to-recall-senator-menendez-turns-into-battle-of-the-constitutions/comment-page-1/#comment-4726 Cardinal_Fang Sun, 17 Jan 2010 16:29:12 +0000 http://www.ifcnews.com/is-new-jersey%e2%80%99s-state-constitution-unconstitutional-campaign-to-recall-senator-menendez-turns-into-battle-of-the-constitutions/#comment-4726 <p>Wasn't the NJ Secretary of State appointed by the NJ governor? In this case, Corzine, who is no longer the governor. Wouldn't it be appropriate for the new governor to fire/replace her?</p> Wasn't the NJ Secretary of State appointed by the NJ governor? In this case, Corzine, who is no longer the governor. Wouldn't it be appropriate for the new governor to fire/replace her?

]]> By: CM Sackett http://www.ifcnews.com/is-new-jersey%e2%80%99s-state-constitution-unconstitutional-campaign-to-recall-senator-menendez-turns-into-battle-of-the-constitutions/comment-page-1/#comment-4725 CM Sackett Sun, 17 Jan 2010 16:14:23 +0000 http://www.ifcnews.com/is-new-jersey%e2%80%99s-state-constitution-unconstitutional-campaign-to-recall-senator-menendez-turns-into-battle-of-the-constitutions/#comment-4725 <p>The 17th Amendment… deals ONLY and SPECIFICALLY with: </p> <p>1. The transference of the power to elect each state's senators… TO THE PEOPLE of each respective state (where, up and until that time ~ 1913 ~ they were chosen by state legislatures). </p> <p>2. Gave each state's governor (if authorized by the state's legislature) the power to choose replacements for any non-election vacancies in the state's senate seats… until an election occurs (see MD's current 'special election'). </p> <p>___________________________________________________ </p> <p>"The Seventeenth Amendment does not affect the restriction in Article I, § 4, cl. 1, which prohibits the Congress from exercising a power to "make or alter" state regulations of elections…" (this line taken directly from Wikipedia) </p> <p>CM Sackett</p> The 17th Amendment… deals ONLY and SPECIFICALLY with:

1. The transference of the power to elect each state's senators… TO THE PEOPLE of each respective state (where, up and until that time ~ 1913 ~ they were chosen by state legislatures).

2. Gave each state's governor (if authorized by the state's legislature) the power to choose replacements for any non-election vacancies in the state's senate seats… until an election occurs (see MD's current 'special election').

___________________________________________________

"The Seventeenth Amendment does not affect the restriction in Article I, § 4, cl. 1, which prohibits the Congress from exercising a power to "make or alter" state regulations of elections…" (this line taken directly from Wikipedia)

CM Sackett

]]> By: Kerry http://www.ifcnews.com/is-new-jersey%e2%80%99s-state-constitution-unconstitutional-campaign-to-recall-senator-menendez-turns-into-battle-of-the-constitutions/comment-page-1/#comment-4724 Kerry Sun, 17 Jan 2010 15:22:06 +0000 http://www.ifcnews.com/is-new-jersey%e2%80%99s-state-constitution-unconstitutional-campaign-to-recall-senator-menendez-turns-into-battle-of-the-constitutions/#comment-4724 <p>War is coming…dems are pushing us too far. Time to take our country back. Stand up and fight for what's right.</p> War is coming…dems are pushing us too far. Time to take our country back. Stand up and fight for what's right.

]]> By: Milo http://www.ifcnews.com/is-new-jersey%e2%80%99s-state-constitution-unconstitutional-campaign-to-recall-senator-menendez-turns-into-battle-of-the-constitutions/comment-page-1/#comment-4723 Milo Sun, 17 Jan 2010 15:17:51 +0000 http://www.ifcnews.com/is-new-jersey%e2%80%99s-state-constitution-unconstitutional-campaign-to-recall-senator-menendez-turns-into-battle-of-the-constitutions/#comment-4723 <p>Judges? Here in Doity Joisey? They are picked from ranks of failed lawyers</p> Judges? Here in Doity Joisey? They are picked from ranks of failed lawyers

]]> By: yossarian22 http://www.ifcnews.com/is-new-jersey%e2%80%99s-state-constitution-unconstitutional-campaign-to-recall-senator-menendez-turns-into-battle-of-the-constitutions/comment-page-1/#comment-4722 yossarian22 Sun, 17 Jan 2010 15:10:46 +0000 http://www.ifcnews.com/is-new-jersey%e2%80%99s-state-constitution-unconstitutional-campaign-to-recall-senator-menendez-turns-into-battle-of-the-constitutions/#comment-4722 <p>It is going to be painful, and with any luck, the patient will not pass away in the process of getting better.</p> It is going to be painful, and with any luck, the patient will not pass away in the process of getting better.

]]> By: J. Berry Johnston http://www.ifcnews.com/is-new-jersey%e2%80%99s-state-constitution-unconstitutional-campaign-to-recall-senator-menendez-turns-into-battle-of-the-constitutions/comment-page-1/#comment-4721 J. Berry Johnston Sun, 17 Jan 2010 15:09:49 +0000 http://www.ifcnews.com/is-new-jersey%e2%80%99s-state-constitution-unconstitutional-campaign-to-recall-senator-menendez-turns-into-battle-of-the-constitutions/#comment-4721 <p>The Progressives want to push thru all they can now while the Democrat like Liberal / Socialist / Marxist administration is in power so if that means screwing their constituents, so be it. I hope and pray the news networks there will let those people know that a right they gave themselves to pull crazy people out of office is being taken away by politics not votes. We need a Reaganite in office quick and more people freaking out and hand writing letters. I have it the worst I live in Nevada with Reid.</p> The Progressives want to push thru all they can now while the Democrat like Liberal / Socialist / Marxist administration is in power so if that means screwing their constituents, so be it. I hope and pray the news networks there will let those people know that a right they gave themselves to pull crazy people out of office is being taken away by politics not votes. We need a Reaganite in office quick and more people freaking out and hand writing letters. I have it the worst I live in Nevada with Reid.

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